Off-roading with John Rigby TRF (Trail Riders Fellowship)
In this episode of Backseat Driver, we’re joined by John Rigby, chairman of the Lancs TRF (Trail Riders Fellowship), to dive into the world of trail riding. We discuss what sets trail riding apart from trials and enduro riding, the history of ancient byways and green roads, and the thrill of exploring the UK’s stunning landscapes on two wheels.
John shares his journey from competitive motocross to the more scenic and social world of trail riding, why it’s a great alternative to road biking, and how the TRF helps riders navigate legal off-road routes. Whether you’re a seasoned rider or just curious about this unique style of motorcycling, this episode is packed with insights and passion for the open trails.
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Transcript
From a pot of tea to TT motorbikes, from a classic English breakfast to a full serving of classic cars.
Speaker A:Bridge House Tea Rooms is the northwest premier classic car meeting location for cars, bikes, tractors and owners clubs.
Speaker A: -: Speaker A:I'd like to introduce the backseat driver, a young lad who is, shall we say, is a bit keen on his motorbikes.
Speaker A:John Rigby, chairman of the Lancs trf, which is the Trail Riders Fellowship, which is a non competitive organization.
Speaker A:It's a national organization as the name infers is from Lancashire.
Speaker A:There is a Yorkshire lot you'll be all pleased to know, but they go out and they enjoy riding what you probably describe as off road motorbikes in beautiful locations for the sheer unadulterated fun of it all.
Speaker A:It's non competitive, so you won't find them screaming past you with your number on the back.
Speaker A:John Rigby, welcome to the backseat driver.
Speaker B:Thanks very much.
Speaker A:What exactly is a trial rider as compared to a.
Speaker A:A trail rider, a trials rider, an enduro rider and everything else?
Speaker A:Because you lot in on competitive.
Speaker A:The UMI water.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's the rides we do are purely for scenic route rides out etc.
Speaker B:So we use road legal bikes.
Speaker B:They are predominantly enduro bikes.
Speaker B:You can use bigger adventure bikes, but we can carry on those.
Speaker B:But where the trials bikes are for you used to see years ago on Kickstart and where people going over large obstacles in a confined area.
Speaker B:The trail riding is literally what it says.
Speaker B:It's riding the trails over the beautiful landscape that we have of the uk.
Speaker A:I conclude just putting in some of these were like the old shepherd's tracks and things like that.
Speaker A:Proper highways and byways from centuries ago.
Speaker B:Yes, the.
Speaker B:They are.
Speaker B:A lot of them are known on the Ordnance Survey map as boats, which is byway open to all traffic, unclassified roads, etc.
Speaker B:But to reiterate, they are legal roads.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:So we have.
Speaker B:You have to have a legal machine that's taxed, insured MOT to go down these.
Speaker B:They are not, as you quite rightly said, it's not a racetrack, it's not a closed off environment.
Speaker B:There are enduro days where you can go around forest and race.
Speaker B:Yeah, but this is not what we do.
Speaker B:We do, we try to cover all aspects of motorcycling, but this is predominantly what we do.
Speaker C:Yeah, I know.
Speaker A:So, I mean, in a roundabout way, it's a combination of off roading and riding on tracks and things like that.
Speaker A:You don't set out to off road.
Speaker A:Do you just have to use very old byways?
Speaker B:Absolutely, yes.
Speaker B:So a ride out for a typical Sunday day would include a lot of normal tarmac roads to get to some of these roads because they're not all connected together and we could do anything from an 80 miles to 150 miles in the Nice summer evenings.
Speaker B:Yeah, absolutely, yeah.
Speaker B:It's not, it's not a little bamble.
Speaker B:If we go riding, we're gonna go for a ride.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker A:I get the feeling unless you let you.
Speaker A:Unless you finish up mucky, you haven't had a good do.
Speaker B:Well, yeah, most of the time you come back mucky or wet from the rain or anything.
Speaker B:We ride, we ride all year round where a lot of our fellow bikers, the road bikers, will put the bikes away around this time of year.
Speaker B:Yeah, we keep going.
Speaker B:We just.
Speaker B:Yeah, we.
Speaker B:As soon as it starts to sn anything, we're out.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker A:You're like me when I.
Speaker A:When I were a lad 30 years ago.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker A:And I used to have Minis.
Speaker A:I used to be out to the local town car park if it snowed, giving it maximum attack with handbrake.
Speaker B:Absolutely, yeah.
Speaker B:The.
Speaker B:There is something about trying to ride a trail where you can't actually know what's underneath the snow.
Speaker B:There could be a.
Speaker B:Could be a pothole, there could be a rock.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:It's challenged.
Speaker B:Better said, it's.
Speaker B:It takes all sorts.
Speaker B:There's all sorts of motorcycling.
Speaker B:This is trail riding.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And this is.
Speaker B:This is what we do.
Speaker A:How did you get into it?
Speaker B:So I've been riding for, we'll just say a few years.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:From when I was a young lad and I started off, ironically, doing trials.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:My dad bought me a trials bike.
Speaker B:He was a big biker.
Speaker B:From that I then figured out that I liked it.
Speaker B:But the thrill of motocross, which was a lot quicker.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Appealed to me more.
Speaker B:So I then moved over and did some motocross racing when I got into the teenage years.
Speaker B:Then after that, obviously I came to license age and I went, oh, I want to ride on the roads because it gives you the freedom to ride around.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So when you could, those days, you could get one at 16 and you could be out.
Speaker B:And that's what started it all off.
Speaker B:And I've had motorcycles in my life in some form or another.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Right up until the present day.
Speaker B:But over the years the roads have got more and more dangerous.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:And they're more controlled to make it safer for everybody.
Speaker B:But the road bikes are so powerful that the.
Speaker B:You struggle to ride them with some passion because of the restrictions.
Speaker B:And as I said, it's just, it's.
Speaker B:You're a target.
Speaker B:I believe at some times that you can be on the.
Speaker A:Said to you.
Speaker A:I have ridden motorbikes.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I stopped because I was fully convinced I'd had a target painted on me.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's just one of them things.
Speaker A:And you think the other thing is, why are you doing that?
Speaker A:I'm riding something that if there were no speed limits you won't come anywhere near to me.
Speaker B:But there is.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Why are you doing it?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's so what.
Speaker B:Where we've now moved over to the.
Speaker B:The trail riding is getting out onto lanes where the most you'll probably see is some walkers or some sheep or maybe the odd tractor because obviously some.
Speaker B:As I said, access to farmers lands as we go past the lands.
Speaker B:And it's just the speed limits for These roads are 20 miles an hour.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Some of the.
Speaker B:These lanes that we ride will be nice open, flowing, the equivalent of like a farm truck.
Speaker A:I conclude some of them could be like paved in a way.
Speaker A:Nearly.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because of it.
Speaker A:Hundreds of years ago they did pave.
Speaker A:Some of them didn't.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:They were cobbled etc.
Speaker B:And then over the years they've been re graded and looked after and they've been stoned and you know that you could nearly get a standard road bike down them.
Speaker B:Then there's, you know, you go to some places in Yorkshire and you go to some places in Wales, you'd be lucky if you can get going more than four or five miles an hour because you'll be either stuck in mud and bog or trying to get over rocks and stones and it's just a different.
Speaker B:It's just a different approach to it and it's a different challenge.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But there's no.
Speaker B:There's no maniac vehicles coming the opposite way or so you know, it's a safer environment.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:It's a different challenge.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:So you're saying you got into it.
Speaker A:What, what made your move to basically trail riding being non competitive?
Speaker A:Because what you have done was absolutely.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:One was getting older because I know the fish.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It hurts more when you fall off when you're old but when you get Old.
Speaker A:Picking them up.
Speaker B:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker A:Making them stand up again and see you get back on.
Speaker A:They'll get already work, won't it?
Speaker B:It was.
Speaker B:The other thing was.
Speaker B:Is you get out onto some places where you see the natural beauty of the country and it is phenomenal.
Speaker B:Some of the.
Speaker B:The sites that we can see in the landscapes and you wouldn't.
Speaker B:And this where we go sometimes you can't get a car that you'd have to be on foot and walk if you weren't biking or mountain bike, etc.
Speaker B:You know, we appreciate the people out there, the cycle as well.
Speaker B:But some of the views are absolutely spectacular.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's.
Speaker B:It's a love for the culinary side as well as motorcycling because, you know, the fast boys want to go round and round racetracks, but you.
Speaker B:You see in the same corner Every sort of 90 seconds.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:A lot of people that go riding motorcycles want to go out for a big ride for the day.
Speaker B:They do it.
Speaker B:You know, we do it as well.
Speaker B:But we want to go and see different sites.
Speaker B:We see things that, you know, it's just a phenomenal sort of.
Speaker A:And I can include cost you not because you're just enjoying it.
Speaker A:You can stop when you want.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Get your flask out, get some sandwiches out and.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:There's no pressure to.
Speaker A:Oh, we must be there for a certain.
Speaker B:Not at all.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:We set out what we plan to do as a route.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:We usually have somewhere where we all congregate to start with.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then we usually try to ride into sort of some shameless plug for.
Speaker A:A bridge house, for tea rooms, which is where you all get together on a few occasions.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That's where I met a few other people and we.
Speaker B:We have a stand then that's usually on the Thursday.
Speaker B:First Thursday of the.
Speaker A:I mean, their bike night is incredible.
Speaker B:It is.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:He's degreasing them to get them in.
Speaker A:And it's a huge area.
Speaker B:So we have a static stand there.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And we can talk to people that want to come in.
Speaker B:There's lots of people out there that will be listening to this podcast that they've got.
Speaker A:Radio show, sir.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That'll be listening to this.
Speaker B:And they'll have an adventure bike, a bigger one by that we're talking about.
Speaker A:I conclude, like the Dakar stuff.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Your BMWs, your big bikes that you see all the panniers and stuff on the big Africa twins.
Speaker B:These sort of bikes now then.
Speaker A:Which I conclude are extremely heavy when.
Speaker B:They'Re fully laid they are, but we still cater for those.
Speaker B:So we will put rides on because we've got guys in our club that have more than one bike in the stable.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And they'll like to go out on those bikes and those, those rides will take in a lot more of the tarmac scenic routes, but will also encompass them some of the off road rides.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:But a lot of your listeners won't be taking these bikes off road because they won't know where to start, which roads they can go down.
Speaker B:Anybody can pick up an ordinance survey map and find these roads on the map.
Speaker A:Because you were saying before we went on air, you look at an OS map and it doesn't.
Speaker A:It tells you that there's a road there.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker A:It doesn't tell you whether it's a legal.
Speaker A:Legal role.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker A:Or it's now a bribe the way or a footpath.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:So what two main things would be for that is before you go on some of these roads, this is what the TRF is there for.
Speaker B:We have what on our website we have something called the Green Road map.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So if you subscribe and become a member of the trf, then you get access to this roadmap and this is updated.
Speaker B:Literally.
Speaker B:That tells.
Speaker B:Gives you basic indications whether if you wanted to plan to ride a certain road.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You can see whether that, whether that road is still open or if it's been temporarily closed due to repairs, etc.
Speaker A:I was going to say, I conclude, given where these roads are, they might get shut off for bad weather or repairing them or doing whatever.
Speaker A:Because I mean, they're hundreds of years older, some of these.
Speaker B:They are, yeah.
Speaker B:And some of them.
Speaker B:So we, we also help that.
Speaker B:So the trf as a national group are all about conservation.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:We try to support the, the local area and then obviously nationally.
Speaker B:Because we want to keep these lanes open.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And we want them.
Speaker B:And obviously if they get too bad, then they become damaged to the environment around us.
Speaker B:So what we.
Speaker B:A lot of the landfill will drain off into the farmers fields and we don't want that.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So we will help to regrade some of these lanes to keep them open because it's in our interest.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Do you ever get it where there's like a diversion because a farmer's doing something?
Speaker A:He'll say, yeah, can he go around very long?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And obviously on the day, because I.
Speaker A:Conclude there are ladies who run.
Speaker B:Absolutely there are.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And then obviously on that, on the day, if that's something you didn't anticipate because it wasn't on, it wasn't on the, the GRM or it wasn't on the local council's website because they list all their roads as well.
Speaker B:If it's not on that, we literally just turn around.
Speaker B:We've got maps on the day that we take with us, we circumnavigate to pick up where we were intending to carry on route round.
Speaker B:So it, there's nothing hard and fast.
Speaker B:It is an enjoyable day out.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:Historically, it's been seen as a middle to later age sort of environment.
Speaker B:So this is.
Speaker B:But it does, it has this sort of, you know, people see it as this, but we're trying to.
Speaker B:So part of my rapport this year is that I'm trying to appeal to the, the younger guys and, and the people that ride bikes in this world.
Speaker B:Yeah, there's, you know, you learn.
Speaker B:As long as I said to you earlier on you, if the bike is mot, it's road legal, then it's insured.
Speaker B:Then, you know, if there's younger people that want to come out on these rides, get in touch with the clubs local to you, which can be found on the TRF website that we'll talk about in a bit.
Speaker B:But yeah, and come and join in and take your bike off road in a legal and an organized way.
Speaker A:I conclude by doing that way somebody might have just like what you might call an ordinary 250 road bike.
Speaker A:I conclude you guys can say, well, you don't come on this ride we're doing, but on the ride we're doing next week you could well be all right on your little.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, yeah, we are.
Speaker B:When we, when we advertise ride, we literally go.
Speaker B:There's a ride usually from our group.
Speaker B:There'll be rides going on all over the country all the time.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:I'm here to talk about our Lancashire group as, as, as a priority.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And we put rides on.
Speaker B:We, we.
Speaker B:I think we worked it out.
Speaker B:Out of 52 weeks, for 20, 23, we did over 60 rides.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:Which means at least one every weekend is going out and that could be it.
Speaker B:It could be an enduro one, which is for the, the, the mud and the harder rocky stuff.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:It could be an adventure bike one for the bigger bikes.
Speaker B:Yetis predominantly tarmac and some trail riding.
Speaker B:And then, you know, we, we always get involved because everybody loves motorbikes.
Speaker B:That's what it's all about.
Speaker B:We even get involved with the odd road ride.
Speaker B:We did the Manchester Ring of Red this year.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So we joined in with all the other road bikers because our bikes road legal.
Speaker B:Yeah, we joined in and we went.
Speaker B:We rode round with them as well.
Speaker B:So predominantly off roading.
Speaker B:But we'll lend our hand to.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:A few other bits and areas of motorcycling as well.
Speaker A:Of course, now we've touched on the subject of the bikes.
Speaker A:I mean, just run me through them because like we were saying, there's the big.
Speaker A:The Paridakhar style bikes and there's.
Speaker A:When I attended the event at Bridge House Tearooms, the number of bikes, there was a vast cross section of bikes from modded stuff that the every wealthy biker simply must have down to some very interesting classic bikes and bikes that you will probably associate more with scrambling, things like that.
Speaker A:So just run us through the bikes.
Speaker B:Yeah, there's.
Speaker B:So everybody thinks that they need to go out and buy the latest.
Speaker B:The manufacturers have got to offer and you need a ten grand or above bike for these trails.
Speaker B:You don't.
Speaker B:Everybody wants the new technology.
Speaker B:But we have guys that come riding out on bikes that are 20 years old.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:As I said, they're still going, they're maintained.
Speaker B:These guys have got a passion for these things like you would do with any motor vehicles with cars etc, that you'll obviously be more aware of than me.
Speaker B:And it's just these bikes will do it.
Speaker B:And it's as I said, we do the rides based on the bike's capabilities and your rider's capability.
Speaker B:We wouldn't take somebody on a ride that they would feel uncomfortable doing or not able to do.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So if anybody comes along to any of the static events that we do or any of our meetings, we have to get involved in it or any other club, then they would usually ask, what have you done before now?
Speaker B:What sort of off roading have you done?
Speaker B:Have you ever been off road?
Speaker B:Or you are you a hardened sort of motocross rider that's been doing it for 50 years?
Speaker B:And then they can set the route.
Speaker A:And also say, what sort of bike have you got?
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then what is more suitable for the style that you want to go?
Speaker B:Because we want to make sure that everybody has an enjoyable day.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And they come back and then they want to go out riding again.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Nobody wants to come back and go, I can't do this, this bike's not for me.
Speaker B:And they just get fed up.
Speaker B:But it's.
Speaker B:That's not what it's about.
Speaker B:It's making.
Speaker B:Getting the most out of the vehicle you've got.
Speaker B:And it doesn't matter what you've got, it doesn't need to be the latest one.
Speaker B:You just need to be prepared when you go, carry some tools, carry some water, carry some food, because as we said, we go to some very remote locations, so a bit of petrol might not go on.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:We always carry some spare, but we always try to factor that in.
Speaker B:And then obviously food, try and factor that in as well.
Speaker B:But there's many a time where, you know, we're fixing punches halfway up a mountain because somebody's got it where your typical road ride out, you'd probably put your leathers on, your helmet, get your phone in your pocket, your wallet and that's all you'd carry.
Speaker B:Yeah, we carry sort of a minimal tool kit with us and spares.
Speaker B:We have to.
Speaker B:Because if we get stuck up there, we have to fix it.
Speaker A:You can't call the garage guy.
Speaker B:No, it's not.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:When you tell the AA and you say, where are you?
Speaker B:And they go, yeah, we don't cover quite up there.
Speaker B:You're like, have to get a bit closer to some tarmac.
Speaker B:But yeah, that's, that's why we do it.
Speaker B:It's a love of motorcycles and it's a.
Speaker B:It's a different area of it and it's.
Speaker B:Yeah, we're happy to prop.
Speaker B:Promote it and happy to support anybody that wants to come along.
Speaker A:You mentioned tires.
Speaker A:Now you look at, you look at the fast road bikes and they're virtually on cut slicks.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:What sort?
Speaker A:Because, I mean, you ride such a cross section of surfaces.
Speaker A:What sort of tires do you go for?
Speaker A:The other thing is you will.
Speaker A:I get the feeling you won't have your tires rock hard.
Speaker A:Do you vary your tire pressures depending on what you're doing?
Speaker B:All of the above.
Speaker B:Really?
Speaker B:But yes, your adventure bikes are usually they run a slightly higher pressure, but the adventure bikes will.
Speaker B:The people look at tires and they.
Speaker B:They call the percentage splitter.
Speaker B:So you'll hear people talk about a 50.50 tyre.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Which means it's designed to 50 of its life on tarmac.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:50 of it on some sort of dirt.
Speaker B:Then you go to the other extreme where they are sort of like 90 off road.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:10 road, depending on what you and your bike want to do.
Speaker B:The majority of the time, the tire you need.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker B:Because if you are going to go on adventure rides, an enduro tire that's 90 designed for off road is great for getting stuck in the mud.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:But for those nice waving roads that are on top, they won't have the.
Speaker A:They won't have the.
Speaker A:Literally they won't have the grip.
Speaker A:It's like trying to drive very fast in a 4x4 with big serious off road tires on it.
Speaker A:They don't stick old.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:So it's, it's, as my dad used to say, horses for courses.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's the tyres that are suitable for the ride you want to do.
Speaker B:And again, some of the.
Speaker B:When you're going over rocks and stuff like that, a lot of people lower the tire pressures because then you get a, a wider displacement for the tire for grip.
Speaker B:But then you don't want a soft tyre when you're out on the tarmac because obviously it looks like rolling flats.
Speaker B:It does.
Speaker B:And it underhands the stability of the bike.
Speaker B:So we actually have people that, that carry battery operated tyre pumps.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So you can literally increase or decrease on the day if you really want to be.
Speaker B:You get the most out of it.
Speaker B:You don't need to be that sort of like precise about it.
Speaker B:But we have some people that do, but we carry them in case people get punches anyway.
Speaker B:So, yeah, if it's there, you could use it.
Speaker A:I mean, the other thing I get the feeling is not the physical size of the bike, but engine size probably isn't quite as critical, providing the engine has a lot of low down torque or else it's correctly geared.
Speaker A:You don't need something that will do 210 miles per hour.
Speaker B:Absolutely not.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:So the, the lighter little Enduro bikes probably will do.
Speaker B:No, because of the gearing and as you said, how it's set up.
Speaker B:They're designed for going, getting yourself out of mud, going over rocks, through intricate roadways.
Speaker B:You probably topping out at 40, 45 miles an hour without doing any damage to the engine.
Speaker B:Obviously the adventure bikes are geared that little bit higher so that they can go on the roads and keep up to the national speed limits, etc.
Speaker B:But then they're not going to be necessarily going over the rocks of the muds that the little bikes do.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Obviously if you want a challenge, bring the big bikes and you know, one bedroom.
Speaker A:Ride the wrong bike.
Speaker B:But you know you've got to rem.
Speaker B:Remember that at the end of the day there's a good chance you'll fall over.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:You what?
Speaker B:You know, and you've got to pick the bike back up again.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:The lighter, the more nimble it is, the easier it is to pick it up, so.
Speaker B:Or just take a load of big burly mates with you.
Speaker B:That'll pick it up for you.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So yeah, it's.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:That's all right.
Speaker A:In a Honda Gold Wing is not the idea of being.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Though there is a guy that's.
Speaker B:That put some off road tires on one I think on some social media that's doing the rounds and.
Speaker B:But yeah, it doesn't do farewell, you know.
Speaker B:But yeah, you can.
Speaker A:At least one thing.
Speaker A:You can't listen to his hi fi whilst all this is going on.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:But yeah, so we've got.
Speaker B:In Lancashire we've got one of the biggest roads we have which is near comes out of the back of Lancaster area.
Speaker B:It's called Salterfell.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And that's a great starter road for people to.
Speaker B:For our club area.
Speaker A:So basically it's ideal for anybody.
Speaker B:It is, yeah.
Speaker B:Because any bike can go down it because it is wide, it is open, there's some great views up there and you can literally.
Speaker B:You could probably ride your Honda Gold Wing down it just about.
Speaker B:But it, the concept is you might.
Speaker A:Get the Mick ting, you might do that.
Speaker B:But it's a great place to start.
Speaker B:And then from that then you can get a feel for it and you, you can go, yeah, this is me.
Speaker B:I want to do some more of this or thanks very much.
Speaker B:That's my limit.
Speaker B:And you know.
Speaker B:Yeah, everybody has their different limitations of what they prefer to do.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So absolutely we, and as a club we try and cater for that.
Speaker B:We'll always, we'll always take people out to their capabilities for what they want to do.
Speaker A:I'm just going to say how difficult is it to learn how to do it?
Speaker A:Do you have to be a decent bike rider to start with?
Speaker B:That's a really sort of like open question.
Speaker B:I think it's like everything.
Speaker B:I think if you've got a.
Speaker B:A natural towards riding a motorbike, then riding off road is just a slightly different skill set.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:The.
Speaker B:Now there will be lots of people out there that will be sort of like pointing at the radio going, no, no, no.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:There's a fundamental difference between it and there is.
Speaker B:And don't get me wrong, and that's if you're doing the hard end duros and the, the racing etc, and there are different techniques of riding an off road bike to riding a road bike.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You move around on the seat more because you're trying to balance your weight more.
Speaker B:You don't necessarily start watching.
Speaker A:What do they call them?
Speaker A:Like Rossi and everybody else.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:You're not trying to get your knee.
Speaker A:Down going around Them shifting weight, I mean, they're going around some corners and they're hanging off.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then we're going up and down some, some steep gradients.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So you're going to balance yourself on the bike.
Speaker A:So you start accordingly, stand up and lean forward a little bit.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Or backwards, depending on what actually you're approaching.
Speaker B:And obviously on the normal road you don't come across a tree that you've got to ride over.
Speaker B:So you've got things like that to appeal to.
Speaker B:So, yeah, there is some more riding skills, but if you've got a natural ability for riding, it's something that can be taught and something that can be learned.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So don't think it's, you know, I can't do it.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You know, somebody will always be at a different level to you, but everything can be, everything can be taught.
Speaker B:So, yeah, just enjoy it and come along.
Speaker A:And the clothing that you wear, is it different?
Speaker A:I mean like the, the lads who like the racing bikes and they're in these skin tight leathers and everything else?
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker A:You guys are wearing something completely different.
Speaker B:Yeah, we, we are sort of more.
Speaker B:We're sort of a little bit more towards the motocross people.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:At one, one point in time it was like it was bell staffing, nothing.
Speaker A:But I think, I think that's all stop now.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:Well, not quite, but I must say.
Speaker A:I do have two proper bell staffs in the game.
Speaker A:But yeah, this isn't a plug for bell staff.
Speaker A:If nothing, probably negative.
Speaker A:You look at bell staff now and you think, well, I certainly won't be wanting to ride a motorbike with that thing on.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:So you need to wear protection because, you know there's rocks and things where you go riding.
Speaker B:So you wear knee protectors predominantly.
Speaker B:You'd see the guys wearing more that you would expect to see on a motocross bike.
Speaker B:The boots.
Speaker B:So they're more motocross or touring boots.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because of the terrain we ride over and then the jackets are sort of more movement.
Speaker B:Because on a race bike, you know, it's head down on a lot of them and head down.
Speaker A:I've tried more Walt, so I thought, I say, how do you ride this for pleasure?
Speaker B:But yes, you need a lot more versatility on the bike.
Speaker B:And then carrying a set of waterproofs as well.
Speaker B:Because I said if the heavens open, you're gonna get wet.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Because you're in the middle of nowhere.
Speaker B:You are.
Speaker A:There isn't even an ale house somewhere around here, is there?
Speaker B:No, we do try to, you know, maybe that's it if we need to for the lunchtime, but obviously we don't promote drinking and riding.
Speaker B:But yeah, obviously some good pub grub halfway through the day to make it enjoyable.
Speaker B:As I said, it's not a race.
Speaker B:Yeah, it is.
Speaker B:We go out, we go for a ride and as we were saying earlier on, we.
Speaker B:We do some mileage and it's not, you know, it can be 80 to 120 miles.
Speaker B:You can, you know.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You've also got to take into fatigue as well because if you're on the road, you can just bimble home.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:If you're out on the trails.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:You can come off the trails and find the tarmac way home.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Which will be the easier one.
Speaker B:But you'll usually find getting to the.
Speaker A:Tarmac could be difficult.
Speaker B:It could.
Speaker B:And you'll usually find that's the longer way round.
Speaker B:Because obviously, you know, we've been off road and we've wrote the route that we were going to ride according to the off road.
Speaker B:But no, never ride past your capability if you're tired.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, that's it.
Speaker A:So I know people think less of you if you got like three quarters way around.
Speaker A:No, no.
Speaker A:I turned around to you and said, thanks very much indeed, John.
Speaker A:It's been a phenomenal night, but I'm going to get myself back home.
Speaker B:No, absolutely.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's all about maintaining that the, the security and the safety of the ride.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's a bit cliche, but it's like the sas, we never leave anybody behind.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So if we get to the end of a trail and we know the six of us, five there, if we take into account a variable distance between one rider and the nurse, if they haven't turned up within a reasonable length of time, about 10 minutes or so or something like that, sometimes it quicker than that.
Speaker B:So because of the length of lane, we will hightail it back and try and find out in case there's a.
Speaker B:There's an issue, etc.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And if.
Speaker B:And if people are getting to that point where they're falling off because of fatigue and stuff, or they're not quite on their game, then.
Speaker B:Absolutely, that's the time to.
Speaker B:To call it a day.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And if it.
Speaker B:And we work it from there at each one, everybody's individual.
Speaker A:Right now you're Lancashire.
Speaker A:So how many, how many trial or trail miles are there in Lancashire?
Speaker A:And I get the feeling you jump over into Yorkshire periodically, we Do.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Now unfortunately we talked and now it's all unfortunate.
Speaker A:You go into Yorkshire.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:No, Yorkshire's one of.
Speaker B:So that we have three main.
Speaker B:Go to points outside of Lancashire, West Yorkshire.
Speaker B:Because literally just over the border we go to Cumbria and we go around the lakes.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then if you want the, as I said, the harder routes and the mud, then we go to Wales.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:To North Wales.
Speaker B:In Lancashire itself, we have very little roads that we can ride.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:But we are fortunate that we have these other counties on our doorstep.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So within an hour, an hour and a half of driving or riding the big bikes, you can be in one of these other areas, these other counties.
Speaker B:And off we go.
Speaker B:And there's a lot of crossovers between the different counties.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:So Cumbria TRF will come riding into Lancashire.
Speaker B:Yorkshire will come into Lancashire, North Wales, etc.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it's, it's in that respect, it then becomes one big club.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Because anybody can join in on the other clubs and say, can I come on one of your rides?
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's not.
Speaker B:You're in Lancashire so you only ride with the Lancashire guys.
Speaker B:Yeah, not at all.
Speaker B:It's a national thing.
Speaker B:So you're just part of the local club.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:That area.
Speaker A:And we mentioned women, ladies.
Speaker A:I don't know whether you're about to mention them these days.
Speaker A:Deary me, how many, how many ladies do do this?
Speaker B:The minority of this moment in time.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Unfortunately there are a few out there and it's.
Speaker B:I don't think I, you know, I don't want to say anything for or against it, but.
Speaker B:Yeah, it seems to be a male dominated area.
Speaker B:There's lots of women that ride road bikes, but not as many percentage wise that will ride off road.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:They are out there and Absolutely.
Speaker B:It's brilliant to see and it's.
Speaker B:We, you know, it's open to everybody.
Speaker B:I think sometimes it can just be.
Speaker B:But it's seen as a, A male tossed male testosterone sort of.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Environment.
Speaker B:And it's not that.
Speaker B:Yeah, we do.
Speaker B:We welcome everybody.
Speaker A:So, yeah, So I mean, if you wanted to get into it, roughly how much would you have to spend on a suitable bike?
Speaker A:Because I lost a thought.
Speaker A:You'd say, well, don't be buying a new one, buy a buyer, buy a used one.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:The first thing that.
Speaker B:Because you, at some point you're gonna drop it and all these guys that buy brand new bikes, it's literally the first ride out and it's scratched.
Speaker A:Well, I can't clear on if you Buy using these all nicely nicely scratched for you.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Buy something to your budget.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because you are going to at some point have to replace maybe the brake lever, the clutch lever.
Speaker B:If you drop it and you break it.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You might break the plastics on it.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because at some point there's a potential.
Speaker A:I get the feeling, looking at some of these bikes, some of the things that are on them are actually designed to break.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:See you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And then there's handguards and stuff like that.
Speaker B:It's with, like, with racing and everything.
Speaker B:Make sure you're protected first.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Spend the money on the equipment that.
Speaker B:For your boots, your helmet, your gloves.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Your knee protectors, your back protectors, etc.
Speaker B:Spend that money first.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:That's because it's.
Speaker B:At the end of the day, the bike can be replaced, repaired.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's harder to do it for you.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Then get.
Speaker B:Then see what you've got left and get involved with the bike.
Speaker B:We have guys that come on bikes that are of all values.
Speaker B:Some people, you know, they go out and they buy the latest enduro or adventure bike for thousands of pounds that have come off the production lines and they're nice and shiny and then we've got the guys that have got 20 year old, as we were talking earlier, that have got the scramblers from years gone by.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And you know that they.
Speaker B:There's not as much money in them and some of them will look maybe battered and bruised.
Speaker B:But as you said a moment ago, these bikes are not just used on tarmacs.
Speaker B:They're going to go places where they're going to get scratched, they're going to get the odd dent in them, they're going to fall over.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But just maintain them.
Speaker B:A lot of people just, you know, put stuff away.
Speaker B:Dirt can get into the bearings of the wheels that your chain can.
Speaker B:You know, people jet wash the bikes and then don't oil the chains afterwards.
Speaker B:We see a lot of unprepared bikes.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:That they've rode a few times and just give it the.
Speaker B:The nice shiny clean rather than a deep clean.
Speaker B:And the maintenance and then a lot of the problems are because they've not looked after the bikes because of the environment they're in.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because, you know, we go through fords of river and we could go through water that's like two, three feet deep.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And you're going to get water, not necessarily in the engine, but we have done before.
Speaker B:But you know, we can drain them out and keep riding on the day.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:But it's.
Speaker B:It's about maintaining the bikes as well.
Speaker B:So it doesn't need to be the most expensive and the newest technology out.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:If there anything else you'd like to tell me?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So the, the club, we.
Speaker B:We meet once a month, the first Tuesday of every month and we meet at the Poachers Pub, which is in Bamber Bridge, sort of just off Leyland Preston, if you're interested.
Speaker B:Obviously.
Speaker B:Any local tours come along, say hello.
Speaker B:Our meetings are opened up for anybody.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:You don't need to be a TRF member to come to our club night.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:Because we, we encourage you to come along and see if you want.
Speaker B:If it's.
Speaker B:Talk to people.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:That is it for you, is it for you?
Speaker B:Exactly, yeah.
Speaker B:If it is, then, and you're interested, then we'll take your name and, and your details and we'll invite you out on a.
Speaker B:A sample ride.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And you get to go out with us and then you get an idea of whether you like it or not from then joining the TRF as a whole and as that's the main thing then gets you access to everything on their website.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it gets you access to the green roadmap and.
Speaker B:And then from there obviously the world's your oyster.
Speaker B:And then as I said, we also try to put rides on for adventure bikes.
Speaker B:We put the.
Speaker B:Some road bike rides on so it's open to everybody.
Speaker B:We do, as we said, we do some static events.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So we've had.
Speaker B:We have a stand we at the Ray Bike Nights in Lancaster when that starts up again next year.
Speaker B:We've done the sprints like Horton Tower, Leighton Hall.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:We've done.
Speaker B:We've had static sounds there.
Speaker B:We've had.
Speaker B:We've.
Speaker B:We've been outside Wigan ktm.
Speaker B:So when people are going in to look at all the nice shiny bikes, we can tell them what.
Speaker B:Where you can go around, where you can use it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And all these sort of things.
Speaker B:So yeah, come along.
Speaker B:We have a Facebook page as well.
Speaker A:Facebook page is Lancashire TRF Adventure Rides.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And your website or the general website is trf.org.uk preceded of course by all the W's.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But John Rigby, it's been a pleasure chatting to you about a subject I don't know a great deal about, but I know a hell of a side more about it now.
Speaker A: at rider and all the best for: Speaker B:Thank you very.
